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PostPosted: Thu Sep 23, 2010 10:18 am 
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Asian Leopard Cat

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I must say that would be IMO a lovely color for Bengals... (melanistic + silver)


It is not going to happen due to the genetics.
The Bengal is an agouti cat i.e. a tabby cat, to accept non-agoutis i.e. melanistics and their silver equivalent the smoke, into the registry, would also mean the acceptance of non-agouti colour-points, i.e. Siamese lookalikes and that just doesn't sit with the small forest dwelling cat image.
I presume the prevalence of the non-agouti gene in Bengals is due to the introduction of the American Short-hair, or the Egyptian Mau or some other domestic breed used in the early days.
Melanistics and Smokes are not "rare" colours, they are quite easily bred if the right cats are used, so it would be possible to produce entire litters of them.
They are only "rare" because, few Bengal breeders deliberately breed them, as they are not a recognised colour. Just like Bombay breeders don't breed red Bombays or Russian Blue breeders don't breed brown tabby Russian Blues or Havana breeders don't breed white Havanas.

It is possible to introduce any domestic cat colour very easily to any breed, often within one or two generations, so we could have tortoiseshell Bengals, red Bengals, lilac Bengals, red smoke colourpoint Bengals, Bengals with four white feet and a white bib, pure white Bengals etc. etc.
All would be "interesting", however breeds need an identity to survive. People like to see an animal and know that they are looking at a Persian or a Siamese or some other recognisable breed: the colouration and look, places them apart from a moggie.
The Bengal has the forest dwelling wild cat identity and is the only domestic breed with rosettes, so the difference should be emphasised IMO, otherwise the Bengal becomes indistinguishable from all the other breeds around including moggies.

The Egyptian Mau and Ocicat breeds do accept the smoke colouration.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2012 10:03 pm 
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Thought I would add some photos of Marmite to this thread, in case anyone else is looking for reference. The breeder registered him as "Melanistic Spotted," but looking at the photos here he's definitely more smokey than some. In these photos he's about 10 months old.

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:)

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2012 11:06 pm 
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junglerose wrote:
Bengal Fan wrote:
Elaine ~

To me the first picture does not look like a Bengal, but the rest do.


Anyone else want to guess? :)



Second Third and last? Maybe?

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2012 11:14 pm 
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Posted that before I read all of them! That is strange I think the other 2 have a more silky looking coat! I have to say I have felt the same about melanistic Bengal , they looked like black cats but there is some , few that I have seen that you can tell are Bengals. Like marmite I think is a beautiful cat! He looks Bengal to me!

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2012 11:39 pm 
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Anouskastar wrote:
Thought I would add some photos of Marmite to this thread, in case anyone else is looking for reference. The breeder registered him as "Melanistic Spotted," but looking at the photos here he's definitely more smokey than some. In these photos he's about 10 months old.

:)


I want your cat. That is all! :lol: (good lord he's GORGEOUS!)

So black bengals aren't considered bengals!? Weird! That's like saying a white lion isn't a lion. It's hardly a bleached duck is it :?

I've never seen a black Bengal in the flesh, i love those mottled melanistics though. I saw a black lion photo the other day... stunning beastie.

I've always loved blackies though. My old moggy was a blackie, I called him Ozzie and he grew so Zeppelin-esque that we nicknamed him Panthercat. He had the big baggy guts, the broad head and nose, the peircing huge eyes and low walk. He'd sit on my legs for five minutes and I'd be paralysed by the time I went to move again. He was a big cat. Lots of presence too.

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In this pic the edge of the bed ends just out of that bottom left corner, and it's a single bed, that's how big he was!
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Many folks used to genuinely think there was a big cat on the moors. We knew it was just old Ozz having a loiter so he could go and bat at the tiddlers in the river.

I met a black Siamese a while ago on my travels through various catteries, she was a sweetheart, she endeared me with these radar dish ears that I was completely drawn in by, lol. I know many folk have superstition of black cats but, it's crazy the amount you see in rescue. The place in Birmingham where I'm picking my bengal up from next week had a whole wing of JUST black cats. I went and said hello to all of them ofcourse :roll: :mrgreen: I also have a soft spot for ginger toms!

I'm such a sucker for a lonely face. I'm sure I'll end up one of those crazy old ladies with a houseful of cats and a brown sofa! :D :shock:

Soph.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2012 11:39 pm 
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Another member on here has a smoke - who is identical colouring to marmite, now I know NOTHING about these colours lol but I did wonder if he wasnt actually melanistic but a silver smoke (I think thats the correct term lol?)

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 4:29 pm 
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Bonesy wrote:
I want your cat. That is all! :lol: (good lord he's GORGEOUS!)

So black bengals aren't considered bengals!? Weird! That's like saying a white lion isn't a lion. It's hardly a bleached duck is it :?


Marmite is registered with TICA as a Bengal, but because his colour isn't officially recognised it means that he can't be shown (or at least not as a Bengal, I presume he could be entered in a general section).

thank you, of course! I also love black cats (as you can probably tell!) :)

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 10:25 pm 
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Anouskastar wrote:
Bonesy wrote:
I want your cat. That is all! :lol: (good lord he's GORGEOUS!)

So black bengals aren't considered bengals!? Weird! That's like saying a white lion isn't a lion. It's hardly a bleached duck is it :?


Marmite is registered with TICA as a Bengal, but because his colour isn't officially recognised it means that he can't be shown (or at least not as a Bengal, I presume he could be entered in a general section).

thank you, of course! I also love black cats (as you can probably tell!) :)


I've also just noticed that 'Mite in your signature looks as if he is smiling! Those patterns on his cheeks make him look for the world like he's full on grinning down into the camera! :mrgreen:

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 11:56 pm 
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Anouskastar wrote:
Bonesy wrote:
I want your cat. That is all! :lol: (good lord he's GORGEOUS!)

So black bengals aren't considered bengals!? Weird! That's like saying a white lion isn't a lion. It's hardly a bleached duck is it :?


Marmite is registered with TICA as a Bengal, but because his colour isn't officially recognised it means that he can't be shown (or at least not as a Bengal, I presume he could be entered in a general section).

thank you, of course! I also love black cats (as you can probably tell!) :)


I think TICA have a household pet section. GCCF have a pedigree pet section so if he was regisered with GCCF (not that his colour is recognised so i guess he would be on the reference register) he could be shown in that.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 12:42 am 
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Have asked an opinion of a breeder friend about marmites colour as I was intrigued and they say he is a silver smoke because of his white undercoat. A melanistic does not have this.

If you wanted to show him he could be shown with TICA under new traits for merit awards.

Have a look here for the different ways to show with TICA http://www.tica.org/public/showing.php

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 8:16 am 
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Thank you Claire, that's really interesting to know. I have always liked how he had more visible patterns than other melanistic cats, and thought so when I first saw photos of him and again when we first "met" him. So I guess that explains it! :)

Does this mean that his TICA certificate should describe him as a silver, due to his undercoat, rather than his black on black appearance?

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 10:13 am 
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What colour were Marmites parents?
One of them needs to be a Silver, in order for Marmite to be a Smoke. :)

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 5:09 pm 
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Their Mum and Dad are both silver. Their litter had silver spotted, and brown spotted kittens.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 13, 2012 5:17 pm 
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Not read the whole thread but those 5 pics I would say;

1) DSH/moggie
2) DSH/moggie
3) Bombay?
4) Bombay
5) Bengal - you can see the markings

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2013 12:45 pm 
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:biggrin: we have a melanistic Bengal, but we cant see his marking, but that doesnt make him any less bengal he Sounds like All our other bengals, he has the markings, his mother and father where bengals, and hes such a lovely guy.

But we cant decide what he is?

he has ALOT of grey in him some days, he has markings on other days, and then some days hes just Pure Black and VERY soft


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