An update....

Rio had porridge looking, stinking diarrhoea. Had amoxicillin drops. All cleared up and doing dark brown hard poops.

3 or 4 days ago poop soft, dark brown and stinking. Yesterday, spot of bright red bloid AFTER he had pooped. Called vet. She gave me another lot of amoxicillin. This morning, 2 dark brown very runny, smelly poops and blood after it. Back to vets. Saw a guy who said now gonna give metronidazole (has to order it in for Tuesday as not got). He mentioned TF so he knows about it (great I didn't have to inform HIM). He doesn't think it is TF but said if the metronidazole doesn't work, then the next step is pcp (I think that's the initials) testing for TF for both Rio and Chilli.

On a brighter note, he has no temperature and is now 1.1kg in weight.

Feeling frustrated but glad my vet is on the ball
Lisa
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Sorry to hear it has returned. I did suspect it would do, to be honest.

It's PCR testing for TF. Metronidazole is from the same family of drugs as Ronidazole which is what is used to treat TF. So please do not test for TF unless at least 2 weeks has passed from finishing the Metronidazole as it will definately affect the result. TF is temporarily stunned by Metronidazole although not killed. Many vets do not know this or believe that it shouldn't matter... they are wrong!

Personally, it sounds like TF to me. I would not bother with this next lot of antibiotics and wait the two weeks and test with TF. He is too small to be messed around really now and, potentially, damaging to his health to have so much diarrhoea so young plus lots of antibiotics without proper testing done. If you hadn't started to give the amoxycillin again you would almost be in a position to test for TF.

After my own experience i will never again treat before doing a full screen. It is just a false economy in many ways plus there is none of the waiting around to allow time to test. We didn't follow this advice and my cats suffered as a result, plus it cost me £100's.

Good luck, if he has Metronidazole liquid then it tastes nasty!!!!!!!


By teh way, i would ask for a full PCR screen. Idexx labs int he UK do a test for a full feline fecal screen by PCR testing which includes TF amongst lots of others. Helps rule things in and out.

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Lollo

Thanks Lollo. Vet said about the difference between Metronidazole and Ronidazole but said he wants to treat with metronidazole first as he doesn't think it is TF. He also said it is only the liquid he thinks and not tablets (urghh). I havd to call Monday and will see if I can have tablet/caplet form instead of liquid.

I said about the antibiotics giving a false reading on PCR testing but he said it doesn't. I know everyone on here says different so will make sure they are out of his system before testing.

Chilli also has soft stools but no blood but I will definitely get both of them tested and the vet did agree with me on this.

I will let you know how I get on.

Lisa
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He is so wrong about antibiotics not affecting TF result. I know loads of people this has affected and it's advice given by Langfords laboratory and leading vets in the US who lecture on TF. I was at a seminar where TF was discussed at length.

Metronidazole is a nasty medicine. It can cause gut issues and is vile tasting. My bengal was on it for a bacterial Liver infection (along with other antibiotics) and he had a tablet but he is 7kg! The tablet was huge and i had difficulty getting him to swallow it. I know the liquid is very bitter and very difficult to give (it is actually the same medicine used in paediatrics and so i have had to give it to many a baby, tasting medicines before giving them to children is important so you can tell them how it will taste honestly, and Metonidazole is very nasty!).

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Lollo

I am thinking the worst too (think I have at the back of my mind all along really) but I am also hoping yhat it is NOT TF and that the metronidazole will cure him (and also that the vet can get the tablets and not the liquid). I keep thinking that not EVERY bengal with diarrhoea has TF - it could be something else.....I am so upset and feel sorry for Rio having to go through this again bur hopefully there will be a solution soon.

How much does the PCR testing cost here in the UK (ish). I have insurance but have to pay the first £65 per kitten as this is a new policy taken out. I'm really angry, tbh, as he had the 4 weeks free insurance and I paid the first £85 (it's gone way past that now and PetPlan are paying the balance over this amount. Because I have continued the policy I assumed he would be covered as it's the same continuing illness but PetPlan say that once the free cover ends, even though the policy is being carried on, it is classed as a new policy and I have to pay the first £65 :(((

Thanks for all your help and support Lollo

Lisa
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My cover with petplan from the 4 weeks free was considered as the same policy. I was not given a new policy number, it just carried on. There was no break between policies and so my kittens were covered for their TF treatment even though the testing started months earlier when on the 4 week free insurance. I would check again and ask them what is the point of the free insurance if you are not protected once continuing the policy. There is no benefit to the customer from taking theirs out over a competitor...!

It cost £65 recently to have the full PCR screen at my vets who sent the sample to Idexx labs. I popped the info for this in you other thread i believe.

I don't think you will get the tablet for your kittens as i believe the dose would be far too great for them.

I also wouldn't test Chilli and Rio separately. I would pool samples together and send off that. Chances are they are both positive and if one is negative you must either treat anyhow or isolate for the two week treatment plus 2 weeks to make sure that no cross contamination happens where Rio passes it onto Chilli before it is killed properly and then Chilli can pass it back to Rio again.... If you are not prepared to separate the cats (i wouldn't myself) then it is essential to treat both.

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Lollo

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Lollo

Excellent advice from Lollo as always. Just to second her that you must allow 2 weeks after any antis for testing TF (regardless of what your vet is saying)

Im puzzled about what this vet thinks he is actually trying to treat with these repeats of ABs.
Have you had a positive result for something and he thinks it is still not killed off?
Did he take samples to re-test before injecting more ABs?
Any regular (common) bugs could already be long dead from ABs but TF is surviving and presenting similar/same symptoms...

The diarrhoea went away briefly and came back, standard ABs didnt kill whatever they have so I dont understand why the vet is not re-testing before re-treating tbh.
If they have TF it would have subsided during AB treatment only to come back which is exactly the symptoms you are seeing....
back to waiting and hydrating again Lisa :( while you wait for a chance to finally test for TF.

If this had been me I would have said NO WAY to the ABs the vet just gave,,, after waiting weeks (of worried nursing time) for the opportunity to test reliably for TF I would have insisted the TF test be done regardless (at my cost) and samples sent off BEFORE I would let the vet stick another needle in or prescribe more ABs.
Lisa, but please do pass on your experience of how you got your boys if you see others (new people on the forum) in the same circumstances asking for advice - and of course let the woman I wont mention know whats going on... Id put money down that she has sick cats right now as we speak.

Lollo

I am at fault regarding insurance (not intentionally). I thought the policy ran out today but it was yesterday so think this is why I have to pay first £65 :((

Bengaldaddy

The results were negative but vet did say at the time some things show sporadically in poop so could be a false negative. Vet said although he's had amoxicillin, this isn't a great antibiotic for diarrhoea and thinks we should try metronidazole rather than not treat and wait for tests to come back.

I have sent a message to the breeder letting them know what is happening

Thanks both of you for your support

Lisa
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Bengaldaddy

I know what you are saying makes sense but when a vet tells you to have antibiotics again, you simply assume they know best (especially as he is TF aware). Maybe I'm naive but I truly thought he knew best.

Lisa
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Sorry to hear you missed the deadline to renew your free-period.
If you can remember back I told you about this (petplan's practice) a month ago but the post it was in is no longer on the forum for me to quote it....
But the gist of it was - dont rely on petplan to remind you to renew ... its not in their interests to do so and you need to chase THEM and be sure not to miss the deadline.

I dont have alot of love for pet insurance companies (a necessary evil).... they will interrupt your dinner with phone calls every night to get your business but when it comes to calling you back to renew a policy and avoid exclusion of current illnesses (which doesnt benefit them) they conveniently dont ring your phone off the wall.

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The little monsters 3