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Bengal Cat Forums • View topic - Sisters suddenly aggressive
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 10, 2015 9:06 pm 
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Bengal Kitten

Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2015 8:19 pm
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This will be a little long, but I'm trying to give a clear picture. You never know what detail might give a clue :(

I have two female bengals who are 20 months old. We've had them since they were about 3 months old. We initially planned on only getting Frost, but the breeder (and research) said that Bengals do better in pairs. The breeder sort of "pushed" Whiskey on us and all but gave her away (he charged us pennies to what Frost cost). Whiskey came to us and immediately had health problems (respiratory infection that went to her eye). But she made a fully recovery and hasn't had any problems since about the 12 month mark. Frost also had health issues (Giardia), which was resistant to treatment, but she's also fine now.

They've never been particularly affectionate with one another despite being (supposed) litter mates. I would describe their relationship as "begrudgingly accepting". Their personalities are very different. To be honest, given the condition we found them in when we took them to the vet, I'm not even sure they're litter mates. The breeder seemed shady to say the least.

Anyway. Here is some info on their personalities.

Whiskey is bigger and has always been more alpha. She has always been aggressive with food - to the point where Frost was rail thin and Whiskey was getting overweight. Whiskey does not like for Frost to get any attention. Whiskey likes being around people, and has a passing interest in cuddles / petting for about 30 minutes in the evening but otherwise just prefers to be in the room where things are going on. She cannot stand to be left out of any room. We keep our bedrooms closed because Whiskey is so aggressive (more below) and she has repeatedly destroyed carpet because she wants to go in any room that is shut. Likewise, she desperately wants to go outside. Unfortunately, aside from walking on a leash (which she doesn't care for), she cannot be an outdoor cat. We live in a townhome and cannot let her run free for fear of her getting hit by a car or attacked by foxes.

Frost is very quiet and loves people. However, she's become incredibly skittish and will not be around anyone if Whiskey is around. She hides constantly. If she does venture out for a little cuddle time, Whiskey will immediately stop whatever she is doing and come over and basically stake her claim. As soon as Whiskey jumps up on the couch / chair / wherever we are petting Frost, Frost immediately runs and hides. Frost is similar in that she, for the most part, just wants to be around people... and has her desire for cuddles in the evening. She seems intrigued by outside, enjoys walking on a leash, but otherwise is content inside. She would like to come into the bedrooms for nighttime cuddles, but we don't let her as I don't think it's fair to leave one cat out and one in. (Plus one time Frost accidentally darted into one of the rooms and we didn't realize it and we closed the door. Whiskey knew immediately and within 20 minutes had dug up the carpet down to the bare floor and damaged the door).

Both cats like to play with DaBird, laser pointer, etc. We try to make sure they get a good chunk of playtime every day. I have an 8 year old and a 20 month old. Frost is very wary of the toddler (for obvious reasons), but will actually let him pet her if he's being calm. Whiskey loves the toddler, I think because he gives her his food all the time. I'm expecting a baby and as my son is more mobile and independent, Mommy and Daddy spend more time on the floor playing with him. (Just putting that there in case this might be a jealousy thing?) I'm pregnant and due in 9 weeks.

So, now for the kitty drama. I will detail what happened today, as this has become fairly typical in the past few weeks.

Today Whiskey began by fighting with Frost. The knock-down-drag-out alley cat kind of fight where I had to separate them. When I did, she began to yowl and hiss at me, clawing me badly in the process. She then leapt at the screen door in our living room, knocking it off the track and escaped out onto our (very small) second floor balcony. I tried to get her to bring her back in, but she was like a kitty possessed - hissing, batting, ears laid back etc. I left her out on the balcony for a few minutes while I checked on Frost, who was shaking like a leaf and grizzling anytime I tried to pet/soothe her. (I later read that you should leave kitty alone when they need to calm down, so lesson learned!). I went back and managed to get Whiskey and brought her inside and separated her with some food and water (thinking maybe this fight was food related even though we've not had any food aggression in months). She didn't touch the food and instead ripped up the carpet. I tried swapping and letting Frost eat and Whiskey roam free, and Whiskey just ripped the carpet up more trying to get back in at Frost. I tried to get Whiskey a few times, deciding to just separate her somewhere where she couldn't destroy anything and let her calm down. She was hissing / biting / batting at me. I finally got her and separated her for about an hour. She wasn't happy, but it gave Frost time to calm down.

That brings me to now. Frost is laying and taking a nap next to my husband on the couch (something she never does if Whiskey is out). Whiskey is calmed and separated in another room.

I don't know what to do. I'm at a complete loss. I can't keep them separated because it's, in my opinion, cruel. They both want to be around us. Whiskey is very aggressive with me, but has never once been aggressive with my husband. I think because I'm the one that breaks up the fights / separates them. This also translates to Frost being very attached to me.

So, I'm not sure what my options are. I don't know what's causing the sudden uptick in aggression. I feel like both cats are miserable. I love both cats. My daughter is afraid of Whiskey (my son is oblivious and Whiskey seems more drawn to the males in the house anyway). I would like to keep both, but I'm honestly to the point where I'm not sure that that is healthy for both of them. I'm petrified about how things are going to be in 9 weeks when I have even less time for attention (assuming that is why Whiskey is lashing out at me?).

ANY thoughts or insight would be helpful!!!


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2015 2:25 pm 
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Asian Leopard Cat

Joined: Thu May 23, 2013 2:21 pm
Posts: 9217
Any time there is a sudden change in behavior, it's best to take the kitty to the vet for a checkup. It's important to rule out anything medical that could be treated and solve the problem. If there's nothing wrong, then you move on.

You described Whiskey as an alpha cat! She's probably very territorial and overbearing on Frost. It sounds as if Frost has lost her confidence and is being bullied by Whiskey. You've had them for quite a while, so you'd think the behavior issues would have been ironed out by now. Each cat needs its own space and territory. That means cat trees, climbing shelves if you don't already have them. Besides, Frost needs a good escape route and bengals love to be high up in the air.

Feliway (plug in or spray) can possibly help. It's worth a try and can be purchased online or at a pet store. The other thing I might recommend is Jackson Galaxy's Spirit Essences. He has several holistic remedies for various behaviors and you may find one that will work for you. http://www.spiritessences.com.

The thing to ask is whether there have been any changes in Whiskey's environment? Just the most subtle thing (like moving furniture around) could set this off. And now that you're pregnant, THIS could definitely be a problem. Cats are very sensitive to hormone changes in humans. Only Whiskey knows what's going on. I don't know that separating them and re-introducing them would help at this point. In episodes of My Cat From Hell, usually, it's cat-ifying your home (as I mentioned above). And distracting Whiskey when you think he's about to pounce on Frost. I know this means observing on your part, but if you truly want to fix the situation, this is most important.

Separate their feeding areas but feed them in the general same area (opposite ends of the kitchen, for example). You say you play with them. I'm guessing with both of them at the same time which keeps the distraction on the toys and not the other kitty.

The problem I see is that you have two small children and another one coming in just a couple of months. That alone makes your plate full. Add on the fiasco with the cats, and it's hard to keep sane. Enlist the help of your husband in dealing with the cats. Look around your home and make sure there are areas for them to climb, multiple sleeping areas for them. Make sure your children are safe from any possible attacks.

Just know there are some cats who do not want to be around children or noise. They want a quiet environment. This is not your fault -- it's just the preference of the cat. If you feel that things are simply not going to work out in the next couple of months, you may have to rehome one or both cats! They deserve to have a happy home and I don't know if finding a new home for Frost will help Whiskey or vice versa.

Your is not an uncommon problem, but it takes time and patience and fixing what's wrong and things will not change overnight. I hope I've offered you some suggestions to try. Good luck and let us know how things turn out.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2015 4:46 pm 
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Asian Leopard Cat

Joined: Sun Feb 02, 2014 8:11 pm
Posts: 1196
Wow, you have a lot going on! As Sherry said, it is quite likely that your hormones are having some affect on Whiskey and Frost.

Can you tell us if they have areas in your home that they 'own'? A place they each have that they like to go to for sleep etc or hang out? As Sherry said, they need vertical space, a place they can go to escape if need be. I have two boys who are 23 months. I was told when we got them they were unlikely to stay friends, are very territorial etc, but we are so far so good. It is I believe around now though that they could fall out if they are going to.

Ours are able to go on top of our hall units, they both sleep on top of the wardrobe in the spare room, although this is mainly Jagger's spot but can sometimes be found together, they have a six foot cat tree and have various different places they can sleep or chill around the house.

So you definitely need to look at how many places they have they can go to, where does Frost go where she can chill and not have Whiskey bothering her?

It is a concern that your daughter is afraid of Whiskey. Is there anything in particular that has happened for her to be so scared? Again this will be picked up on by Whiskey and she will respond in kind. Has Whiskey always lashed out at you, or is this new behaviour that could be linked to your pregnancy? I doubt it is because you are the one to break up fights etc as I am also that person in this house and I don't receive that response. It is very important that they are treated exactly the same as jealousy can be an issue, do you think Whiskey feels you prefer Frost?

Get the feliway plug ins, and look at your home, where they go, where they are comfortable etc, where Frost goes to get away from Whiskey. If you can describe to us what you have and where they hang out, what they consider their places, we may be able to help more.

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Clare
Hendrix and Jagger, Brown Marble Boys (born 18 August 2013)
Hampshire, UK


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2015 6:00 pm 
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Asian Leopard Cat
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Joined: Thu Dec 02, 2010 1:00 am
Posts: 4490
Location: Portland Oregon, USA
Yea, that's a tough one. I think you have two choices: try to improve the two cat's relations, or rehome one of them. And I can't really recommend one or the other.

If you do want to try to make it work, then I think you have to start with catification. Basically building up vertical space for the cats in "socially significant" places in the house. In other words let each cat stake out some territory up on cat trees and cat shelves without having to be constantly pestered by the other cat. You should probably do this anyway, even if you decide to re-home (for the sake of whichever cat you keep) but it could also be a large piece in the solution to your problem.

There are lots of good resources to learn more. Certainly the Jackson Galaxy "My Cat From Hell" episodes, his "Catification" book, books like "Cat vs Cat", and lots of discussion threads here where people have had similar problems.

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The little monsters 3


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2015 6:28 pm 
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Asian Leopard Cat
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Joined: Tue Sep 23, 2014 6:38 pm
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I have two 15 month old girls. Grace is the alpha and sweet Blondie is at her mercy. We have experienced many of the exact issues you describe. Feelaway plugins work like magic. I used them when they were babies. I started researching and following this forum as they matured.

Cat towers give them their own personal space just for them. I put their first one in the kitchen next to the patio door so they could watch me cook and keep an eye on the outdoors. I have a set of shelves in the living room on the back of a door. In the bedroom they have two cat trees. One is 80 inches and they love it. They used to sleep on it and fight over the top spot. Then I got a second one with two cat clouds leading up to a shelf in the wall up near a high ceiling. They also have a screened in patio and spend a lot of time out there chasing lizards and watching wildlife on the lake in the back yard.

Now they have many options and only fight over who gets to be on the bed with me. Blondie has slept on the bed with me for the past week which is surprising because that is Grace's territory. Grace stopped sleeping in the bedroom with us at that time. I suspect she is sleeping on a new scratcher lounge in the living room that arrived right about that time.

They are complicated creatures and don't follow our code of what's fair. Give them plenty of distractions and equal love and attention. My kitties are constantly changing. Right now they both seem happy and are getting along.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2015 7:06 pm 
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Asian Leopard Cat

Joined: Thu May 23, 2013 2:21 pm
Posts: 9217
It's interesting that cats have different personalities that can become at odds with each other -- just like people. I just know the OP has her hands full already and this just adds to the stress in the household. Preparing for a new baby is never easy, so everyone pretty much has to pull together to make this work. Those members on here with multiple cats have worked HARD to have a harmonious family. Brian, Jill, and Clare -- you all have the same situation. Appreciate your input and hope this helps this women out.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2015 8:17 pm 
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Bengal Kitten

Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2015 8:19 pm
Posts: 2
First of all, I have to say a huge thank you to everyone that has responded. You have no idea how much I appreciate the time and recommendations you've all given. Also, I admit, I was afraid to post my woe's on the internet!! It seems that so many people can quickly get judgmental on forums, and this forum has proven to be the opposite. It really means so much to me.

I will say that Whiskey lashing out at me has occurred post-pregnancy. And she won't ALWAYS lash at me. If I'm on the sofa in the evening, she rests at my feet (like a puppy! A little odd b/c we don't restrict the kitties from the couch at all, haha, but she seems to prefer it). She will occasionally curl up on me, but my hubby is definitely her preference :) To the poster who mentioned jealousy - that's an interesting point. I certainly don't *mean* to prefer Frost over Whiskey, but I will go out of my way to search out Frost and give her cuddles / petting (she's usually hidden in one of the kitty condos or on one of our chairs under our dining table). I don't do that with Whiskey usually because if she wants cuddles, she makes sure she's getting them, haha. But I definitely "baby" Frost more than Whiskey.

Whiskey does not really enjoy climbing / being up high. She is a ground hugger unless she sees Frost in one of the kitty condos, then she might go up and boot Frost out. She's never climbed a condo and hung out there on her own. Frost is my jumper. We have shelves and 7 foot tall entertainment units that we have cleared off her her, in the hopes that it would give her some "space" away. Whiskey has never tried to go up there. I've added some soft blankets and things up there to help them feel like a true kitty area (and not just a shelf). We have 2 kitty condos (6 feet tall). They have 2 "perches" and a little "house", and lots of that nice rough rope and both kitties love to scratch on them. We don't restrict them from really anywhere. So there are a lot of other places where they can hang out, but again, Frost is the one that goes "up", Whiskey doesn't go much higher than a coffee table - well... except for counter surfing. Even then, I only get frustrated when Whiskey tries to eat leftover people food if we've not cleared the counters from dinner yet. She will - literally - eat anything. Anything. I worry about it making her sick. This is probably kind of gross - but beyond that I don't care if they get on the counters. I just clean everything before I start food prep. My thought is that they're hopping up there when I'm not around anyway, lol. If I see it happen, I'll pick kitty up and redirect, but I don't spend a lot of energy getting mad about it. They know that counters == food, so of course they're gonna hop up.

My daughter seems afraid of Whiskey mostly b/c the aggression she sees between the two kitties. She is incredibly timid with Whiskey, but will scoop Frost up and snuggle her no problem. Whiskey has scratched my daughter a time or two, so that adds to it. (These times were not super aggressive, more "I don't want to play now" kind of things. Or "Okay I wanted 3 rubs, now get the heck off of me". Typical kitty stuff).

Here are some pictures of the two:

Whiskey (cuddling with me)


Frost (a year ago, she's harder to get pics of now)


Frost (more recent, before we added stuff to the top of the aforementioned units)


Hubby is 100% willing to work with me on this (in theory - his heart is there, but I know he's exhausted when he gets home from work, so sometimes it's a little harder for actual execution). I'm looking into the Feliway diffusers now :)


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2015 9:45 pm 
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Asian Leopard Cat

Joined: Sun Feb 02, 2014 8:11 pm
Posts: 1196
Ok so they have plenty of vertical space should they want it, which is great. What are their sleeping arrangements?

Good you are getting the feliway, some of this does sound like Whiskey is sensitive to your pregnancy hormones so hopefully that will help.

If Whiskey is aware that Frost gets more attention from you, that might not be helping your relations with her. When we first had our two, Hendrix hurt his paw and was getting more attention as a result, plus he liked playing fetch so my other half used to play with him more. Jagger became unhappy and quite aggressive as a result. Once I recognised the problem, I worked hard to rectify matters as Jon was obviously favouring Hendrix. So I was very strict that they get the same amount of cuddles in front of each other - they are always watching and checking as well, believe me! If we get them on their own and they want cuddles, obviously they get as many as they want. Jagger was always involved in any play whether it was fetch or not, and he is now the sweetest cat you could wish for.

So maybe work on that as well (vats are very perceptive!) and see if it makes a difference and then perhaps go back to basics with your daughter and rebuild her confidence around Whiskey. Hopefully, Whiskey being happier will result in less attacks on Frost who will get her confidence back and then it will be wait and see what happens when the new addition arrives lol

It is hard work with two and you gave your work cut out with your young family as well, but I hope it all works out for you. Keep us informed and we will try to help you along the way once we know what is working and what isn't.

They both look beautiful so fingers crossed for progress!

_________________
Clare
Hendrix and Jagger, Brown Marble Boys (born 18 August 2013)
Hampshire, UK


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2015 12:25 am 
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Asian Leopard Cat

Joined: Thu May 23, 2013 2:21 pm
Posts: 9217
Whiskey and Frost are gorgeous bengals!!! I can see why you love them so much. Bengals do insist on getting attention and both kitties need to be treated equally, even though they may not act equal. It sounds like you have a lot of catification going on. Some cats are tree dwellers and some are bush dwellers and it seems you have one of each. That should help Frost out because she can jump up and get away from Whiskey. All you can do is try to keep the peace around there and hope Whiskey calms down a little. You've kept your sense of humor over all of this -- and one truly needs a sense of humor when it comes to dealing with children and two cats.

This is a great forum because everyone tries to help out and give advice, when people need it. We get a lot of desperate posts like yours and we simply try to offer some advice and give you some options that you may not have thought of. We are simply cat owners.

Welcome to the forum!


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