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PostPosted: Thu Aug 16, 2012 8:23 pm 
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viperkeeper wrote:
lollo2304 wrote:
Would you kill the spiders if they posed a threat to your life and that of your loved ones?

On your logic if you lived in Africa and a lion killed your cat. You'd pick up a gun and lead the hunting party to go shoot lions right? It wouldn't matter if you killed the lion that got your cat, just kill as many lions as you can to make sure it never happens again.


No, that is not my logic at all.

I would not expect a lion to come into my house and kill my cat or my loved ones. If i lived in Africa, my cat would not be outside at all unsupervised so, if a lion came into my house and killed my cat i may shoot it, i may just save my own life if i could without killing the lion.

I found out that the house that the Brown Recluse Spiders caused problems had only had a few rooms sprayed the first time as they thought the spiders had only gained access to the back area of the house. The second lot of spiders were found in a different part of the house. The breeder has young grandchildren that stay as well as several other cats. I would not think twice about killing that spider or it's brothers in the house by having it sprayed. It would not be safe to just catch the couple that you found and 'rehome' them as there maybe others not in plain sight. If the owner had done nothing and then her grandson was bitten and died (because she couldn't face killing the spiders) she would have been irresponsible. When you have children, you have to think of their best interests.

I am lucky that i live in a part of the world that has very few poisonous creatures so i do not have to make that decision. However, i can assure you that my family would come first over any spider/snake/other poisonous or dangerous creature.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 16, 2012 8:31 pm 
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viperkeeper wrote:
Lollo2304 wrote:
Cats have lived in the wild in many parts of Europe and the Orient for 100's of years. They are part of the ecosystem in those areas. It is very different than feral cat communities in other areas of the world that have come about in recent times due to abandonment of pets.


I'm confused 7Deadly$ins stated feral cats we have native cat species here too. That's not the argument.
Are you trying to say those places have had feral cats for 100's of years and there not a problem YET?


It was my understanding that 7Deadly$ins was stating that the feral cats were to blame in causing problems in the ecosystem. My argument is that is some parts of the world feral cats are part of the ecosystem after being there for 100's of years even before humans settled. SO they are not to blame in those areas for destroying wildlife and making the ecosystem unbalance. It is very different to feral communities of cats that exist due to abandonment of pets.


There are many breeds of cats that have existed on the streets of certain countries, almost entirely pure bred. The khao Manee is a prime example of that. Many breeders have considered going to Thailand and bringing back cats to use in their breeding programme.


Whether they are vermin in those areas and cause problems is a different issue. Pigeons, rats, squirrels, foxes, mice etc are all considered vermin in some areas. It's like a 'weed' is only an unwanted plant in that position....


There are many breeds of cats that have existed on the streets of certain countries, almost entirely pure bred. The khao Manee is a prime example of that. Many breeders have considered going to Thailand and bringing back cats to use in their breeding programme.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 16, 2012 9:15 pm 
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viperkeeper wrote:
" type mini lizard that can cause harm" Name It there's only two dangerous lizards and once again not from Greece. I think you are being told tails buy uninformed natives. This happen everywhere in the world they believed here that the "daddy long leg" is deadly in our southern regions most think the "black racer" is venomous its not and coke and pop rocks will make you exploded. The most deadly centipede is from Peru and the odds of death are nill in fact its questioned that its capability of death only the native claim it can kill the only other one's with strong venom are from Asia. I've been doing my research and the only dangerous spider is the black widow something we have here and is rarely fatal and only bits protecting its young or to avoid certain death. No dangerous scorpions or centipedes but they have some big ugly ones. The only dangerous snake is the Blunt-nosed Viper, Macrovipera lebetina its rare avoids humans and in great decline.

I can't see a cat killing a black widow why would it? And the bite could easily kill a cat. Same with the Blunt-nosed viper they stay away and sightings are rare and it could kill a cat too.

The most dangerous animal in Cyprus is the introduced wild dogs the account for the most injuries and death.

So unless you have some facts other than old wives tails I'd say you are completely wrong.



So you wiki'd and googled..................I lived there.

I can't name the lizard, I don't know it's name but it's skin is poisonous, not deadly but it leaves a lovely rash.

The blunt nose snake is dangerous, sightings are not rare, saw a fair few with my own eyes in 1) my garden 2) neighbor's gardens and 3) out in the bush.

I'd say you need to stop thinking you're always right. I've been in A&E in cyprus when kids have had a severe allergic reaction to certain reptiles and have been biten.

Cats were more than likely in cyprus before man set foot there. With the coming and goings of the country's history, cats would have been introduced 1000 yrs ago.

I don't state things, unless I actually know them ;)

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 16, 2012 11:41 pm 
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If I say "In some areas feral cats are a problem" do I REALLY need to say that in some areas, they aren't? It should be implied.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 17, 2012 6:04 am 
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Greeneyes wrote:

So you wiki'd and googled..................I lived there.

I can't name the lizard, I don't know it's name but it's skin is poisonous, not deadly but it leaves a lovely rash.

The blunt nose snake is dangerous, sightings are not rare, saw a fair few with my own eyes in 1) my garden 2) neighbor's gardens and 3) out in the bush.

I'd say you need to stop thinking you're always right. I've been in A&E in cyprus when kids have had a severe allergic reaction to certain reptiles and have been biten.

Cats were more than likely in cyprus before man set foot there. With the coming and goings of the country's history, cats would have been introduced 1000 yrs ago.

I don't state things, unless I actually know them ;)


Yes I Googled it. I've been studying Herpetology my whole life and been collecting them for twenty some years. Living there does not mean you really understand them. Most places in the world have some deadly animal that is harmless. Around here its the daddy long leg spider. Southern states the black racer, India the ornamental spider, Iraq the camel spider. The camel spider, jumps on a camels belly eats its way inside and devoures it inside out. They come into tents bite you on your toe to paralyze you and eat you while you watch. Milksnaks attach themselves to the udders of cows and drink milk. In Italy tomatoes were considered poison and deadly to eat at one time. The world was flat too. These are all facts at one point but seem silly now.


On your poison lizard NO lizard is poisonous or secrets any toxin in fact this applies to all reptiles. Possible explanation may be the lizard walks through something that causes the reaction. Or its not a lizard at all but an amphibian there are types of salamanders and newts that secrete toxins. You can have a reaction to a bite from a reptile because of the disease there pray carriers or bacteria inside their mouths.

"I'd say you need to stop thinking you're always right." Please prove me wrong I sincerely mean this "I Like To Be Wrong" every time I'm wrong that means I've learned something new. I'm on a quest for knowledge and the more answers I get the more questions I have. But I require actual facts not hearsay opinions.

"Cats were more than likely in cyprus before man set foot there. With the coming and goings of the country's history, cats would have been introduced 1000 yrs ago."
Can you elaborate that statement? I'm not sure that means a feral cat then?

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 17, 2012 11:56 am 
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viperkeeper wrote:
I'm not sure that means a feral cat then?


According to several dictionaries i looked at, as well as what i already though myself, Feral can mean something that exists in a wild or untamed state, or that it is suggestive of a wild animal. In addition to the common use of the word regarding cats.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/feral
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/feral

Wikipedia is different but it is often wrong anyway.

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 17, 2012 12:43 pm 
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lollo2304 wrote:
viperkeeper wrote:
I'm not sure that means a feral cat then?


According to several dictionaries i looked at, as well as what i already though myself, Feral can mean something that exists in a wild or untamed state, or that it is suggestive of a wild animal. In addition to the common use of the word regarding cats.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/feral
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/feral

Wikipedia is different but it is often wrong anyway.


My interpretation of the phrase "feral cat" is of an animal that "has reverted to the wild state, as from domestication".
However feral could be used to define the wild behaviour of a cat ie it acted in a feral way, meaning it acted LIKE a wild cat.
I would not describe the ALC or a Scottish Wild cat as a "feral cat", however some of the "natural breeds" like the Khao Manee may indeed have feral ancestry, in that they were domestic cats gone stray.

I would like to say that the Singapura or Singapore drain cat has been found to be more likely to be a made up cat from basically Burmese lines, bred in Michigan, USA, than it is to be a "natural" Singapore cat.
I am therefore very sceptical of such "natural" pure-bred cats like the Khao Manee.

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